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	<title>Comments on: Right Round, Baby</title>
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	<link>http://www.sub-burbs.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/</link>
	<description>Starting a FemDom marriage in the Vanilla Kingdom</description>
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		<title>By: JIM</title>
		<link>http://www.sub-burbs.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/comment-page-1/#comment-950</link>
		<dc:creator>JIM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Apr 2007 22:40:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timidboy.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/#comment-950</guid>
		<description>My apologies, I must have missed that line.  But, yes, I understand where you are coming from 100%.  

If you want to read / talk more, that is not a problem.  I have a blog started, thanks to chris here, on my side of the tracks, on thoughts and such.  He should have it linked in his Blogroll, if not http://me.wolfhawk.net

But, yea, I can send you an email, and we can discuss, not an issue young lady.

Hawk
(AKA JIM)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My apologies, I must have missed that line.  But, yes, I understand where you are coming from 100%.  </p>
<p>If you want to read / talk more, that is not a problem.  I have a blog started, thanks to chris here, on my side of the tracks, on thoughts and such.  He should have it linked in his Blogroll, if not <a href="http://me.wolfhawk.net" rel="nofollow">http://me.wolfhawk.net</a></p>
<p>But, yea, I can send you an email, and we can discuss, not an issue young lady.</p>
<p>Hawk<br />
(AKA JIM)</p>
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		<title>By: MWK</title>
		<link>http://www.sub-burbs.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/comment-page-1/#comment-946</link>
		<dc:creator>MWK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:14:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timidboy.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/#comment-946</guid>
		<description>Actually Jim, I am VERY happy that they are going to be able to work it out - as Chris deserves as much happiness as he&#039;s willing to claim. Even in the &quot;best situation&quot; I would have been prepared to offer Chris, that as &quot;beta boy&quot; he still would have been just that... &quot;Second&quot; and a &quot;boy&quot; - and he deserves to be #1. In the relationship he&#039;s fighting to hold onto, there is a chance, no matter slim or sure, that he can have it all in one person: an &quot;in love&quot; romantic relationship, a best friendship, and a Goddess to worship - whereas with me, he&#039;d always be only able to go &quot;so far&quot; and be forced to constantly battle with his desire for romantic love and submissive servitude. He&#039;d have to be crazy not to at least TRY it... it&#039;s the stuff dreams are made of. And from what I know about the situation and what I continue to read... he is willing and able to do the hard work. Which is extremely commendable.

There was a phrase or two in Chris&#039; original post in which he said &quot;I blame myself for this as much as Mistress Trecia&quot;, which is why I felt demonized and blamed for the current situation - for &quot;blurring lines&quot; of all things. Do I feel the lines got blurred? I suppose they did, do I feel responsible, no I don&#039;t because I really did everything in my power to be perfectly clear about MY limits and boundaries... and which assumed boundaries of Chris&#039; marriage I was willing and knowingly stepping over or around. 

Does that mean I am COMPLETELY free of guilt? No, hell no. I knew this wasn&#039;t some weekend warrior I was dealing with. I KNEW Chris NEEDED this aspect of who he is, validated and accepted. And I knew it fairly early on, and definitely by the time he was preparing to visit me. Where do I feel I &quot;failed&quot;? I feel my biggest mistake was when I realized how essential service is to his core being, that I didn&#039;t insist that he was COMPLETELY honest with Jaci THEN! Not weeks and/or months down the road.

As for the intimacy thingie, I understand that - TOTALLY! I would be fairly devastated if my husband formed an intimate emotional bond with another. Especially if/when this bond begins getting more attention, devotion, and adoration than I am getting. That being said, it will NEVER happen. (Knock on wood) At least not on this scale - because I am present in my husband&#039;s life. I am engaged, plugged in, and involved. My hubby can BARELY spend one night on the couch in the instances of illness or argument - and there is NO way I would stay in a committed relationship with someone who appears and feels emotionally absent. There&#039;s sure as shit no way my hubby would walk around for almost an entire month with a piece of metal through MY cock, and me not know.

So there were obvious intimacy issues at home, something that I did address with Chris, just not as strongly as I possibly should have. And if anyone REALLY needs to hang a sign of culpability on someone/something I personally think they should start here.

All and all, it&#039;s been an amazing and awe inspiring journey, and one I am blessed to be able to watch even if it is from the cheap seats.

And finally Jim, I would love to have a conversation or two with you, so if you are at all interested, please contact me at MWK@whimper4wk.com

Much luck and success to Chris and Jaci and all their readers, may you find all you seek and enjoy the discovery.

MWK</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually Jim, I am VERY happy that they are going to be able to work it out &#8211; as Chris deserves as much happiness as he&#8217;s willing to claim. Even in the &#8220;best situation&#8221; I would have been prepared to offer Chris, that as &#8220;beta boy&#8221; he still would have been just that&#8230; &#8220;Second&#8221; and a &#8220;boy&#8221; &#8211; and he deserves to be #1. In the relationship he&#8217;s fighting to hold onto, there is a chance, no matter slim or sure, that he can have it all in one person: an &#8220;in love&#8221; romantic relationship, a best friendship, and a Goddess to worship &#8211; whereas with me, he&#8217;d always be only able to go &#8220;so far&#8221; and be forced to constantly battle with his desire for romantic love and submissive servitude. He&#8217;d have to be crazy not to at least TRY it&#8230; it&#8217;s the stuff dreams are made of. And from what I know about the situation and what I continue to read&#8230; he is willing and able to do the hard work. Which is extremely commendable.</p>
<p>There was a phrase or two in Chris&#8217; original post in which he said &#8220;I blame myself for this as much as Mistress Trecia&#8221;, which is why I felt demonized and blamed for the current situation &#8211; for &#8220;blurring lines&#8221; of all things. Do I feel the lines got blurred? I suppose they did, do I feel responsible, no I don&#8217;t because I really did everything in my power to be perfectly clear about MY limits and boundaries&#8230; and which assumed boundaries of Chris&#8217; marriage I was willing and knowingly stepping over or around. </p>
<p>Does that mean I am COMPLETELY free of guilt? No, hell no. I knew this wasn&#8217;t some weekend warrior I was dealing with. I KNEW Chris NEEDED this aspect of who he is, validated and accepted. And I knew it fairly early on, and definitely by the time he was preparing to visit me. Where do I feel I &#8220;failed&#8221;? I feel my biggest mistake was when I realized how essential service is to his core being, that I didn&#8217;t insist that he was COMPLETELY honest with Jaci THEN! Not weeks and/or months down the road.</p>
<p>As for the intimacy thingie, I understand that &#8211; TOTALLY! I would be fairly devastated if my husband formed an intimate emotional bond with another. Especially if/when this bond begins getting more attention, devotion, and adoration than I am getting. That being said, it will NEVER happen. (Knock on wood) At least not on this scale &#8211; because I am present in my husband&#8217;s life. I am engaged, plugged in, and involved. My hubby can BARELY spend one night on the couch in the instances of illness or argument &#8211; and there is NO way I would stay in a committed relationship with someone who appears and feels emotionally absent. There&#8217;s sure as shit no way my hubby would walk around for almost an entire month with a piece of metal through MY cock, and me not know.</p>
<p>So there were obvious intimacy issues at home, something that I did address with Chris, just not as strongly as I possibly should have. And if anyone REALLY needs to hang a sign of culpability on someone/something I personally think they should start here.</p>
<p>All and all, it&#8217;s been an amazing and awe inspiring journey, and one I am blessed to be able to watch even if it is from the cheap seats.</p>
<p>And finally Jim, I would love to have a conversation or two with you, so if you are at all interested, please contact me at <a href="mailto:MWK@whimper4wk.com">MWK@whimper4wk.com</a></p>
<p>Much luck and success to Chris and Jaci and all their readers, may you find all you seek and enjoy the discovery.</p>
<p>MWK</p>
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		<title>By: JIM</title>
		<link>http://www.sub-burbs.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/comment-page-1/#comment-943</link>
		<dc:creator>JIM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Apr 2007 15:34:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timidboy.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/#comment-943</guid>
		<description>I have known timid for a long time now and there are a few other issues at hand besides what he has placed here.  Even if he posted every little detail, knowing some ones heart and what the other fully feels, will only be known to the both of them (him and his wife).

MWK,  all I can say is, interesting.  May I make a rebuttal from an outside point of view.  

1 â€“ Just from reading the blog, he has mentioned few times you were ENCOURAGING him to work things out, I have not seen once were he stated you told him to break it off.

3 â€“ Yes, I do agree with the Loving and In-Love with you.  But he is a â€œpuppyâ€, I have found in last few months that in the last 5-6 years Dogplay/puppyplay has become itâ€™s own little segment and gaining popularity.  I have been into it since before the explosion.  I have found most â€œpuppyâ€™sâ€ give their hearts feely, and where it on their sleeve. Pupâ€™s trust all to quickly usually blindly.  With â€œpuppyâ€™sâ€ Dommeâ€™s have to be extra careful with them due to these slight variance from boy/slave.  Even with the wide range of â€œpuppyâ€™sâ€ there are, each is different with different limits as with boy/slave.  But most who are true â€œpupâ€™sâ€ are loyal to a fault, regardless who it is.  And yes, I am a pup as well as a handler, I am rare in the fact I can switch modes and understand them.  And I too, have to snap myself out of certain feelings for someone sometimes.  I am not knocking you, as I respect all Dommeâ€™s and understand all can not know of every little thing in the â€œsceneâ€.  Even I am learning things nearly every day.

And yes, you straight folks have it easy with 1 closet door to open.  I have 3, gay, leather, and pup/handler.  Each has itâ€™s challenges.  But just saying heâ€™s making you the bad guy in all this, I think not.  He is not demonizing you from what I have read or in any of our discussions.  Even if it ends up down the road they do get a divorce, will you be the primary reason, NO.  Will it be because you are a Domme, NO.  Thing would be, he was married and went outside the marriage for intimacy.  Is that your fault, NO.  He is taking responsibility on that one by confessing to Jaci on what he has done.  And they are working things out.  You unhappy with that???

And yes, timidboy should be renamed as timidpuppy.  For he is more pup than boy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have known timid for a long time now and there are a few other issues at hand besides what he has placed here.  Even if he posted every little detail, knowing some ones heart and what the other fully feels, will only be known to the both of them (him and his wife).</p>
<p>MWK,  all I can say is, interesting.  May I make a rebuttal from an outside point of view.  </p>
<p>1 â€“ Just from reading the blog, he has mentioned few times you were ENCOURAGING him to work things out, I have not seen once were he stated you told him to break it off.</p>
<p>3 â€“ Yes, I do agree with the Loving and In-Love with you.  But he is a â€œpuppyâ€, I have found in last few months that in the last 5-6 years Dogplay/puppyplay has become itâ€™s own little segment and gaining popularity.  I have been into it since before the explosion.  I have found most â€œpuppyâ€™sâ€ give their hearts feely, and where it on their sleeve. Pupâ€™s trust all to quickly usually blindly.  With â€œpuppyâ€™sâ€ Dommeâ€™s have to be extra careful with them due to these slight variance from boy/slave.  Even with the wide range of â€œpuppyâ€™sâ€ there are, each is different with different limits as with boy/slave.  But most who are true â€œpupâ€™sâ€ are loyal to a fault, regardless who it is.  And yes, I am a pup as well as a handler, I am rare in the fact I can switch modes and understand them.  And I too, have to snap myself out of certain feelings for someone sometimes.  I am not knocking you, as I respect all Dommeâ€™s and understand all can not know of every little thing in the â€œsceneâ€.  Even I am learning things nearly every day.</p>
<p>And yes, you straight folks have it easy with 1 closet door to open.  I have 3, gay, leather, and pup/handler.  Each has itâ€™s challenges.  But just saying heâ€™s making you the bad guy in all this, I think not.  He is not demonizing you from what I have read or in any of our discussions.  Even if it ends up down the road they do get a divorce, will you be the primary reason, NO.  Will it be because you are a Domme, NO.  Thing would be, he was married and went outside the marriage for intimacy.  Is that your fault, NO.  He is taking responsibility on that one by confessing to Jaci on what he has done.  And they are working things out.  You unhappy with that???</p>
<p>And yes, timidboy should be renamed as timidpuppy.  For he is more pup than boy.</p>
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		<title>By: timidboy</title>
		<link>http://www.sub-burbs.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/comment-page-1/#comment-868</link>
		<dc:creator>timidboy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 22:33:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timidboy.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/#comment-868</guid>
		<description>In all of this, I&#039;ve only made one slightly negative comment, that being that I thought I was falling too deep and that I felt we both let that line slip.  The venom in your comment seems very far out of proportion.

I am keeping the blog up and running because, as you once stated, it might help others who were lost and struggling like myself.  To steal your analogy, think of it as swimming lessons off the long pier.

I&#039;m sorry it had to end this way.  I will always be grateful that you helped me find myself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In all of this, I&#8217;ve only made one slightly negative comment, that being that I thought I was falling too deep and that I felt we both let that line slip.  The venom in your comment seems very far out of proportion.</p>
<p>I am keeping the blog up and running because, as you once stated, it might help others who were lost and struggling like myself.  To steal your analogy, think of it as swimming lessons off the long pier.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sorry it had to end this way.  I will always be grateful that you helped me find myself.</p>
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		<title>By: MWK</title>
		<link>http://www.sub-burbs.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/comment-page-1/#comment-853</link>
		<dc:creator>MWK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Apr 2007 17:20:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.timidboy.com/2007/04/28/right-round-baby/#comment-853</guid>
		<description>There have been many posts in the past few days I felt compelled to speak on, but I have been trying to remain quiet and in the background to let TB and his wife figure out their primary relationship. I feel this post has basically forced my hand and I feel I need to comment. 

I feel it&#039;s in very bad taste to take an instrument of devotion and degrade it to a platform for &quot;sour grapes&quot;. Why not just nuke it, scrub all traces of me, and start a new blog, one in devotion of your wife, or your discovery process, or the journey? Seems that would be easier on everyone.

Now a few points that obviously need clarity:

#1 I NEVER encouraged you to dissolve your relationship with your wife, quite the contrary. I treated you like any other of my boys in a committed relationship and ATTEMPTED to tailor you &quot;assignments&quot; to include your wife. I only abandoned that approach with you when you repeatedly came to me after your advances were rejected by your wife apologizing for &quot;failing me&quot;. Because you described your relationship with your wife as &quot;perfect in every way except sex&quot;, I was hoping that a sexual approach with the focus being placed on her needs would foster some intimacy.

#2 Nor did I EVER imply that I wanted a romantic relationship with you. I made it very clear that even in my wildest fantasies that could include you in the role of one of my &quot;live ins&quot; my husband would always be the focus of my romantic and traditional/vanilla sexual energies... AND that your wife would be welcomed and appreciated to fulfill your romantic and non D/s needs. Hell I even joked about hubby topping your wife while I topped you boys, since we both agreed that she seems to have a sexually submissive identity/affiliation.

#3 Did I love you? Sure, of course I did... as I said before I honestly considered you my puppy. Did I fall in love with you? No... my heart does and probably always will belong to my husband. I can&#039;t imagine myself ever asking for my heart back, but then I don&#039;t give it lightly either.

#4 I didn&#039;t and still don&#039;t think that our feelings of deep care for one another is the real issue, but I no longer feel EITHER of you has what it takes to recognize that distinction. Nor do I think you have the courage to handle the implications.

I think this whole situation is very sad, but it&#039;s quickly becoming embarrassing. In my chosen PROFESSION, I am all to aware how quickly and easily I become the bad guy. And if that&#039;s &quot;enough&quot; for you and yours, to demonize the big bad Dominatrix, then fine... that&#039;s your perrogative. But I refuse to be hung for trying to introduce you to the concept of unconditional love and acceptance... or for holding up the mirror so that you can see yourself for who/what you are.

My assertion is still the same, all I REALLY want for you is peace, understanding, love, and happiness, however I can no longer hold your hand on your journey.

I keep thinking of the &quot;lifeguard&quot; analogy: the lifeguard REALLY wants to save you, but he&#039;ll let go and watch you drown if you keep flaying about. It&#039;s sink or swim time.

Good luck.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There have been many posts in the past few days I felt compelled to speak on, but I have been trying to remain quiet and in the background to let TB and his wife figure out their primary relationship. I feel this post has basically forced my hand and I feel I need to comment. </p>
<p>I feel it&#8217;s in very bad taste to take an instrument of devotion and degrade it to a platform for &#8220;sour grapes&#8221;. Why not just nuke it, scrub all traces of me, and start a new blog, one in devotion of your wife, or your discovery process, or the journey? Seems that would be easier on everyone.</p>
<p>Now a few points that obviously need clarity:</p>
<p>#1 I NEVER encouraged you to dissolve your relationship with your wife, quite the contrary. I treated you like any other of my boys in a committed relationship and ATTEMPTED to tailor you &#8220;assignments&#8221; to include your wife. I only abandoned that approach with you when you repeatedly came to me after your advances were rejected by your wife apologizing for &#8220;failing me&#8221;. Because you described your relationship with your wife as &#8220;perfect in every way except sex&#8221;, I was hoping that a sexual approach with the focus being placed on her needs would foster some intimacy.</p>
<p>#2 Nor did I EVER imply that I wanted a romantic relationship with you. I made it very clear that even in my wildest fantasies that could include you in the role of one of my &#8220;live ins&#8221; my husband would always be the focus of my romantic and traditional/vanilla sexual energies&#8230; AND that your wife would be welcomed and appreciated to fulfill your romantic and non D/s needs. Hell I even joked about hubby topping your wife while I topped you boys, since we both agreed that she seems to have a sexually submissive identity/affiliation.</p>
<p>#3 Did I love you? Sure, of course I did&#8230; as I said before I honestly considered you my puppy. Did I fall in love with you? No&#8230; my heart does and probably always will belong to my husband. I can&#8217;t imagine myself ever asking for my heart back, but then I don&#8217;t give it lightly either.</p>
<p>#4 I didn&#8217;t and still don&#8217;t think that our feelings of deep care for one another is the real issue, but I no longer feel EITHER of you has what it takes to recognize that distinction. Nor do I think you have the courage to handle the implications.</p>
<p>I think this whole situation is very sad, but it&#8217;s quickly becoming embarrassing. In my chosen PROFESSION, I am all to aware how quickly and easily I become the bad guy. And if that&#8217;s &#8220;enough&#8221; for you and yours, to demonize the big bad Dominatrix, then fine&#8230; that&#8217;s your perrogative. But I refuse to be hung for trying to introduce you to the concept of unconditional love and acceptance&#8230; or for holding up the mirror so that you can see yourself for who/what you are.</p>
<p>My assertion is still the same, all I REALLY want for you is peace, understanding, love, and happiness, however I can no longer hold your hand on your journey.</p>
<p>I keep thinking of the &#8220;lifeguard&#8221; analogy: the lifeguard REALLY wants to save you, but he&#8217;ll let go and watch you drown if you keep flaying about. It&#8217;s sink or swim time.</p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
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